DEF?

[Gungrave]

Is it ever going to be buffed?

I know it was vastly overpowered last version, but now it seems you need so damn much of it to even get a decent dodge percentage, even then theres some fights where I come out with half my hp, just from chance, I think DEF needs more of a base to it, rather than just hope they miss you..when and if parry is being added to it, that might help

but im just wondering whats going to happen to it, or should I just stop adding to it now

[Dlorak]

Thanks for bringing this one up...
First, DEF is underpowered compared to FOC.

I had to realize that FOC's crits don't balance flattly with DEF's dodging because FOC also gives greater HIT% on the offensive side, all my balancing was implicitly based on 100% chance to hit. It was a mistake. DEF is underpowered compared to FOC.

Bottom line, yes there has to be a buff to DEF. I'm playing with
1. increasing ARMOR% relative to your level from your DEF (something I have argued against in the past, I know I know)
2. parry (quick returned attack, uses your turn)
3. reversal (instead of their attack damaging you, it damages themself)

I like #1 the best... I even have a hunch we can reduce that variability DEF dodging introduces with it.

[fingolfin]

So adding to def will add to your damage reduction %, What would the cap on this be?

[Gungrave]

honestly I think DEF adding to total % reduction is the best, the way monsters are now, stronger, it would probably make it more balanced, I mean now you can literally not add to DEF at all and not feel any major impact..

you just need so much in DEF to even make it work, when the other stats do so much more

2 is a bad idea, if you have high def you can parry yourself to death, 3 is pretty good but i can see that becoming overpowered, id stick with 1

[Dlorak]

2 is a bad idea, if you have high def you can parry yourself to death

battles are time-based now, Gungrave. Parry would just accellerate your next turn. Say you have 2sec before next attack, it could reduce that by say, 75%, and you'd attack in 0.5sec.

3 is pretty good but i can see that becoming overpowered

yeah no doubt, it would have to be a small % chance to proc.

I mean now you can literally not add to DEF at all and not feel any major impact..

totally not true, you should get critted to death. if you have 1 DEF the oppoenent will have a 100% chance to get 1.75x damage! (uh oh.. do mobs not crit??)


As another thought, I think some significant HP gains tied to DEF could really squash that element of weak DEF (say, +3 to +7HP per point... I'll crunch some numbers and compare results with the +%Armor idea and see what feels right)

[TenaciousD]

(uh oh.. do mobs not crit??)

Mobs are still critting, I get them still with only 2% mob crit on me most of the time.

[fingolfin]

Mobs do crit Dlorak, but it doesnt make a difference. I posted this in a dif thread but it seems appropriate here- From the point of view of my build, i think Def is less useful vs mobs now, but still ok for pvp/pk. I have been a 3def 2str build every lvl, im at about lvl 710 right now. Fighting the hardest mobs in the game i kill them in 3-4 hits without any critical hits, dodging about 30% of the time because of my def. Strictly fighting mobs I think focus would have been a better way to go. If i were a 3foc 2str build would have the same str, yet I would have first hit on every mob and be getting a lot of crits, meaning i should be able to kill a mob in 1-2 hits instead of 3 or 4. My lack of def for dodging or the mob critting wouldnt be a big issue if im only getting hit once or twice.