Def formula voting

[Jon_Deciple]

well im in favor of a wipe... and looking at it from a post-wipe POV, option two or three look good... IM more in favor of two because theres no "dead zones", every def pt will effect your ttl def... where option three there would still be dead zones, unless its rounded to like, .001.

Either way, when its changed, people will wine, complain, and life will go on, we will adapt. I like the idea if reducing mob str along with the ttl def because that means in contrast players will deal much more damage to each other. Meaning tournies are going to get real interesting XD

Nooblet may be screwed for lvling, but for tournies hes gonna own!

[Sora]

with #2 thou jon, if at any point you stop adding def, your bonus begins to go down as you level.  Where as #3 if you stop adding to def it doesn't get lower.

[BillyBoy]

Hey, what about this!?

(Def/3) + Armor Power = Total Def

Total Def = Percent Blocked (Maxing at 95%)

WHAT A GROUND-BREAKING IDEA!!

[Amaruak]

Magebill wins the cookie!

[Dlorak]

Hey, what about this!?

(Def/3) + Armor Power = Total Def

Total Def = Percent Blocked (Maxing at 95%)

WHAT A GROUND-BREAKING IDEA!!

Are you being sincere? I cant tell   

• if so, you want to let items stagnate, leaving them as simple stat boosters with no other function? (if you want to argue this point, think about it for awhile before posting)
• And let everyone (the lvl1000 fighter with the highest-DEF equipment is the same as the lvl1000 mage with armory-equipment) be equally well defended?

As Sora said, changing the DEF formula is GREAT chance for quest to move forward as a game by allowing more customizability in the ITEM-BUILDS and STAT-BUILDS available.

This is a groundbreaking opportunity

[Dlorak]

i now have possible formulas

Def = (Base Def + mod def)

X = 3(95 - armor#)                                                    (X is the amount of Def needed for 95 total)

If Def < or = X ; armor# + (def/3) = total def               (notice this is corrent formula modifided)
If Def> X ; 95 + (Def - X) * [0.001] = total def             (Max total def alowed would be set to 99%)

the 0.001 is for the 4k max def

Max       Number =  (4% / max) * 100                         
2k           .002
3k           .001333...
4k           .001

Can you recalibrate this in terms of 60 DEF wherever you have 95DEF?

[_Ares_]

probably can but i dont know if it would work with the reduced monster strengths the code stuff confuses me so i havent understood what they are

[SirJ00]

i might as well quit, my char has no def at all.... i think it should be primarily based on your equipment and totally remove the stat.

 that is just my opinion but frankly, i dont play too much so i dont really care what happens

[Jon_Deciple]

Somhing like changing def isnt such a huge deal... Sure people's builds will get screwed over a little, or in some cases a lot, but mob damage is also going to be reduced... And with people usually hitting first, that first hit will reduce their damage more...

And chances are theres some sort of agreement people could make... Like perhaps we could get a def bonus... All players could get their stats padded so they take about the same damage now as they did before the stat change...

Look at it from the view of a new char... Supposing you started a new char, which formula would offer the most expansion? The more i look at it, number three has the greatest potential... Defence items with numbers > 95... armors would not be soo limited... You could have an armor number 1000 or higher, even if a PoN was like, 500, and weapons had def mods like say 200, 3 other slots, 200 each... thats 1300 def...

I like it.

The more i think about it, the more i like it. Sure the current chars i have will be screwed... but theres soo much future potential! Guys, look past the "My chars gonna be screwed, if it happens im quitting" and think about the future. Think about how things might work with more

I like the idea of lower defence... PVP will be all that much more exciting because players can do some REAL damage to each other... Tournaments will be exciting! New items will be worthwhile... Eventually current items can be made to have decent defmods...

Come on guys, open your minds... let your brains fall out... Stop thinking 95% damage blocked... Start thinking more defence items, higher def mods, more def mods from more items... Out of the box thinking!

Assume a player puts 2 pts / lvl to def for calculaions. max of 3 pts / lvl would supply the upper end... Armor number mods would have to be implimented. And i would be interested in knowing what sort of def mods these new items might have...

Anyways, im changing my vote from 2 to 3, as its looking more and more like a good option

[SamAdams]

you guys keep talking about how much more diverse it would be if this is implemented... how so? If you HAVE to add to def almost constantly, don't the other stats see a decline? How do we see more damage? Because everyone else is weaker too?

Mabye I'm closed-minded, mabye I resist change, and forgive me for not wanting the character I've put so much work into be screwed so newbs can have it easier than I did when I was a newb, but apparently I'm not alone *gazes at the voting board* Not that it matters, it seems that no matter what the majority wants the newbs win. Yeah, sure, some of us will adapt... but since when is Quest about being able to evolve in order to be able to tolerate changes that only add diversity to TWO builds? Warriors and Mages. Oooooh, big deal. There's already too many builds for both classes, mabye more energy should be put into more classes if you want this game to move forward and be more like a real game. As opposed to screwing everyone who has played for very long as it is.

[Sora]

Before I get into my relatively short post I will state the following:

People, do not just skim the comments in a topic but, READ ALL THE WORDS.

With the DEF formula's being discussed there would be no need to add ANY DEF if you have not already.  It would not effect you at ALL.  You would continue to get hit for the same now as if you had 95 TTL DEF.  What is being discussed whoever is to make it avaiable for people who add to defense beyond the "95 TTL DEF" to receive future damage reduction.  I said "95 TTL DEF" because with changes you would no longer need "95 TTL DEF" to receive the damage you are seeing now, but only "65 TTL DEF" and you could then  add to DEF to get higher then "65 TTL DEF" and receive less damage.  THAT IS WHAT IS BEING DISCUSSED.  Please read ALL the words and not just the words or groups of word you decide you want to read.


*wonders off pondering the doomed fate the human race has been displaying lately in recent actions*

[Tina]

I'm gonna have to jump in here and address a couple of things, Sora.

First I have to say, that you need to keep in mind that people can read ALL THE WORDS of these posts, and still not get it. I mean that in no negative way. We are not all coders, and not all computer geeks (no offense intended) and some people don't GET all the implications of the changes we're talking about. You admonishing them..does not HELP them get it.

Second, and perhaps more importantly, Dlorak DOES get that not everyone understands what we're talking about here. And to that..I mean..when Dlorak, Jouser, etc...read these posts..they get who is posting based on understanding, and who is posting based on misunderstanding. That's what matters. That the developers get it.

I am here to say, that for those of us who may post with our issues, concerns, concepts..that DON'T entirely get the coding and formula implications of everything that we are addressing...POST ON.

You'd be surprised at how many times someone who doesn't seem to entirely get where we're going chimes in with something WE DIDN'T GET.

[Gungrave]

defense stat should be based upon sex appeal, lol good luck trying to hit me kthnx

[Alexis]

Being one of those people that doesn't understand ALL the coding i saw this.

If Def> X ; 95 + (Def - X) * [0.001] = total def             (Max total def alowed would be set to 99%)

I personally would love the idea of being able to have 99% defense meaning be able to block 99% of all damage but is it really something that SHOULD be achieved? Maybe blocking 99% is a bit much. I've never seen an RPG game where thats been possible without a crit.

[Jon_Deciple]

The idea is a lower max total def, allowing for a greater number of mods from more item types.

Having one mod from armor numbering 0 to 95

vs

having many mods from 6 items ranging 1 to 1000


which do you think is allowing for a greater amount of advancement of this game?

That and being able to take more damage from players is appealing to me. I want to PK it out with Amar and have a fight of it! make things interesting... None of this "I have 4000 HP, and you have 12000 MP, nobodys dying tonight" busness.

[Jessy]

gun posting on jess here

k, serious post time for a change

in terms of a defensive formula for pvp, I wouldnt bother at the moment, regaurdless of how much damage you take/recieve, all you will still do is click click click, hoping for lag..if defense is severely reduced to the point where it would take around 3-10 hits to kill someone, even then, againts and evenly geared player (since everyone is nowadays) its just going to become whoever attacks first really

k, now in terms of a defensive formula for pve, the one we have now isnt that bad, i think you should do something along the lines of every 3dex/3def adds say 2 total defence points, then somehow change dex so it affects dodge/parry alot more, to make them actually usefull,adding the dex and def into the equation to actually get a block or a parry, adding that into pvp to.. then simply after say 80% reduction with 95 total armor, you would extend that to 90% but you would need MAJOR defensive items that specify on defense stats, and nothing else, which you would sacrifice for offensive type stats

this game needs more balance, not my 3hp lolwarrior build or 3int omgown mage, adding in something similar to the above will affect what items they would wear, suddenly, that high hp isnt doing anything for your leveling speed, and oh no those guys dodging you in pvp are owning you

all that from a simple def change

[inurro]

If it's not broke, don't fix it! (And I say it's not broke )

[Jon_Deciple]

gun posting on jess here

k, serious post time for a change

in terms of a defensive formula for pvp, I wouldnt bother at the moment, regaurdless of how much damage you take/recieve, all you will still do is click click click, hoping for lag..if defense is severely reduced to the point where it would take around 3-10 hits to kill someone, even then, againts and evenly geared player (since everyone is nowadays) its just going to become whoever attacks first really

k, now in terms of a defensive formula for pve, the one we have now isnt that bad, i think you should do something along the lines of every 3dex/3def adds say 2 total defence points, then somehow change dex so it affects dodge/parry alot more, to make them actually usefull,adding the dex and def into the equation to actually get a block or a parry, adding that into pvp to.. then simply after say 80% reduction with 95 total armor, you would extend that to 90% but you would need MAJOR defensive items that specify on defense stats, and nothing else, which you would sacrifice for offensive type stats

this game needs more balance, not my 3hp lolwarrior build or 3int omgown mage, adding in something similar to the above will affect what items they would wear, suddenly, that high hp isnt doing anything for your leveling speed, and oh no those guys dodging you in pvp are owning you

all that from a simple def change

I agree sort of...

Ok the click click lag die PK meathod could change with a new def formula. If those who put all their stats to dealing damage could easially kill people (one to to hits) then there would be no need for lag. Conversly, those who went all HP could take many (4 or 5) hits from these people, which would produce a standstill because they cant deal damage...

If the def formula is changed, it would allow for more defensive items. theres currently 7 slots for items on people. One potion, a weapon, and 5 armours. As the defence formula is now, it doesnt leave much room for expansion. 95 total def points to be spread amoung 5 slots... leaves, what, less than 20 per item...

if it was converted so armours had, say, 5000 def (as supers) then theres a LOT more variance for items, and you can have much more different effects based on different armours.

I say remove the 3 stats lvl limit. let people put 5 stats in whatever they want. this would allow for greater HP builds, greater STR builds, and a much greater variety in how you can make your chars.

The def formula... its fine for quest now, but it doesnt leave any room to expand.